January 7th, 2008

Mixed feelings

Posted by danny in Hardware, Linux, Software

My laptop died a spectacular death the other night.

Everything on it was working mostly fine,but I had decided that after playing with xubuntu, on my EEE PC for the last few weeks, that I wanted to give it a go on the big beast.

I downloaded the AMD64 iso, burned it to a nice new Fuji CD-R, and rebooted with the disk in the DVD Drive. All looked good until the installer got to 76%, and just stopped doing anything. I did a bit of trouble shooting, including re-burning the CD, doing looking for checksum errors, as well as using an external DVD-RW to install, instead of the internal one, which has been flaky lately.

Turns out, the 120 GB Seagate Drive I bought to replace the 100 GB Hitachi Drive (which had died a horrible death) is developing some bad sectors, in the area that I had specified for /usr. Consequently, the OS was refusing to install.

Being the stubborn fuck that I am, I refused to admit defeat, and kept poking around with it, before I take the disk back to the store I purchased it from for an RMA. I did the obscene, and installed Vista. Which, has lead me to some interesting observations.

  • Vista installed on the partition with bad sectors,with no problems at all.
  • Linux was refusing to install on the same sectors.
  • Linux would, and did install with no problems at all, so long as I avoided installing data to those sectors,the (x)(k)ubuntu installer simply refuse to write to them. I haven’t tried vanilla Debian yet, but you know me, and I will.
  • Vista, is still a fat, bloated pig. I installed Vista Business, because it has all the features that I want (I use an NT Domain at home, with my media server acting as the domain controller), with out the features that I don’t care about (native support for TV Tuner cards, etc)
  • xubuntu, with XFCE, is fast as hell with very little tweaking. Everything just works, including my Broadcom wireless card. No issues at all.

I am having mixed feelings on how the installation went though, and what my experiences with Vista have been.

At first, I was irritated to shit that the Vista installed was “better” and able to work around those bad sectors with no problems at all. I was bothered, that my beloved Ubuntu, was not able to make the same corrections, and that I was going to have to RMA the disk. Then, I sat back and thought about it for a bit.

Vista, gave me no indication at all that there was a problem with the hardware, it probably just mapped around the sectors in place, and ignored them. This means, I lose (probably at most a few Kb) of hard disk space. But, it ignored the fact that the disk is dying. This could, in the future lead to complete and total data loss, if the disk died with no indication. The ubuntu installer, was at least gracious enough to say “hold it, there is a problem her” and give me an error code, that I could google, and find out what was going on.

I am honestly, not sure which approach I like better

  • The Vista approach was great, because it just worked. I had a working laptop again a couple hours later, once it completed installing. It was like that one brand of hair coloring, Nice N Easy.
  • The Ubuntu solution was to not install at all. I can see how this would help to perpetuate the myth, that Linux is hard to install and use.
  • The Vista approach, would have eventually lead to a catastrophic failure of the disk, with no warning at all, but at least I would have had a computer to use in the mean time. No wonder PC’s have a reputation for being fussy, and unreliable.
  • The ubuntu solution, told me right away that there was a problem, but only because I am an experienced enough user (I’ve been using Debian, and it’s variants damn near exclusively since 2001) that I knew ctrl+alt+f1 would take me to a console, that was spitting out the error message. There was nothing at all to indicate a problem with the hardware from the X11 based installer. It just failed completely. No error, nothing. My dad, would have never found the problem.

Both solutions have their advantages, but both of those advantages, at least in my mind cover up a severe shortcoming in the product in question.

Personally, I think the ubuntu approach, with the increased focus on reliability, should be the way things are done. They should have made it easier for me to trouble shoot what the problem was though. I know that ubuntu, with it’s focus on “Linux for the people” is trying to make things as easy as possible for all of us, and making me drop down to a console to trouble shoot an installation problem does not help to achieve that goal at all. Having said that, I am pretty sure if I chose the advanced install options, it would have given me more information, so I am probably at fault here.

The Microsoft approach, to me at least seems to be one of covering blemishes with a really heavy make up. I don’t really have a huge problem with them doing that, it is after all their expected behavior. What I do have a problem with, is that it was not their blemish that was covered up. It was Seagate’s. Possibly even Compaq’s. I have no problem with a company that does not want to air their proverbial dirty laundry, but the fact that the installed gave me no indication at all that there was a problem with the hardware bothers the hell out of me. It was no a Microsoft problem that they were covering up, it was a problem, it was more serious than that.

I am currently playing with some SMART monitoring tools under xubuntu, to try to get more information on what exactly is wrong with the disk, so that I can have a print out of the errors when I take it back to the store, in order to alleviate any “this guy doesn’t know wtf he is talking about” issues with the tech’s. I will keep you posted.

2 Responses to ' Mixed feelings '

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  1. ooly said,

    on January 12th, 2008 at 8:12 am

    Personally, I’d rather an installer tell me the disk is dying than have it not inform me of an issue, and mask the problem. Puttng hard work into an install and watching it go arse-over-tit a short time later, to only have you install _again_ with the new disk could be extremely frustrating and time consuming…

    Geeks like to know what is going on… Joe User doesnt give a shit until his machine becomes a brick, and has to take it into the nearest store asking ‘why not my komputer workith?’

    Bit off topic… i have finally tried out ‘twinview’ with a couple of older monitors. I don’t think i can go back to a single monitor again Dan… I can’t believe I have been missing this for all these years… and openbox 3.4.5 fixes up some twinview bugs from 3.4.4!

    I took a screenshot once for reference and posted it online so the store tech could view my ‘bad memory’. I’ve also in the past printed out log files from a disk with bad sectors and took it back. The printout got looked at as i explained to him how i came to the conclusion the drive was snafooed. The screenshot never did, but he knows me well :)

  2. danny said,

    on January 12th, 2008 at 12:13 pm

    I like that method as well, it’s better to know that there is something wrong with the hardware.

    What I don’t like however, is that the X11 installer based installer simply quit. No error message, no indication that anything was wrong,

    A nice little pop up box, with an error message that said “Hey, your disk is fucked, and I can’t finish. Here is an error message you can google!” would have been wonderful, and would have saved me literally hours of time.

    In the mean time, I kept fucking around with it, went to install X Pro onto it, for shit and giggles. The disk made this awful screeching sound about 70% of the way through the format, for about a minute, and then the installer died saying there was no disk present. This BIOS won’t even detect the disk now, It’s getting RMA’d later today.

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